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Transformer question

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13 years 7 months ago #10762 by xj700
Transformer question was created by xj700
I have a portable layout that I want to power off of a car battery. I need a transformer to operate my loco.
Anyone know where I can get one, or at least how to MAKE one? I'd hate to use just an old tv potentiometer. I need something more safer.

Thanks in advance.

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13 years 7 months ago #10763 by markm
Replied by markm on topic Re: Transformer question
Hi,
A transformer works only with AC not DC. A potentiometer with an inline fuse (since with the power of a car battery you could weld your train to the track) is actually a fair solution. Otherwise, you need a variable DC regulator. If you feel electronically inclined search for an LM317 data sheet/application note whcih have a 3-8V example. Otherwise I'd suggest you check out a Snail Controller. The data sheet I have says it will accept a 12V DC input.

Mark

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13 years 7 months ago #10765 by shamoo737
Replied by shamoo737 on topic Re: Transformer question
sounds like too much trouble to go trough. I use a Ztheck battery powered controller, and it works very well. You can run a GP35 for six or seven hours on one battery, and they are sold by Ztrack.

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13 years 7 months ago #10768 by markm
Replied by markm on topic Re: Transformer question
In general I agree. If you have the parts sitting around the house, a regulator is easy. Although I must admit I recently purchased the Ztheck Snail Controller simply because it cost less than buying the components and doing it myself.

My biggest concern is the power that a car battery brings. At 1.2-1.5KW of purge power, a short circuit could literally melt track and wiring and cause locos to burst into flames. Of course it has the capacity to power 5-8 thousand of you favorite engines.

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13 years 7 months ago #10769 by xj700
Replied by xj700 on topic Re: Transformer question
I have a notched increment power transformer (that goes from 3, 4.5, 6, 9 volts). I might rig that up & see if that will work.
Thanks for the replies though, I'll definitely check out all the options you all gave me.

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13 years 7 months ago #10770 by garthah
Replied by garthah on topic Re: Transformer question
It is kind of foolish to try and save about 50 bucks on a proper power supply when doing it destroys a 150 dollar engine. If you want cheap get a 9v battery and 1K pot and hook them up and you can run your trains on the cheap. What you are proposing may seem logical using a car battery and a transformer and will work but the side effects can kill you and your Z engine and layout. 12vdc can kill as can 120vac it is all a matter of amps.

cheerz Garth

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13 years 7 months ago #10771 by stonysmith
Replied by stonysmith on topic Re: Transformer question
:laugh: You should only use a car battery if you are trying to put your train into orbit. :laugh:

Or.... if you are trying to turn your precious $1500 Challenger into a lump of molten slag metal!

The last time you jumped a car.. did you feel your jumper cables get warm, or even hot? That's because there's too much current flowing. (fyi.. if that does happen, you need thicker jumper cables) Apply that amount of current to your train layout (even without a short) and you'll likely get the rails to the point where they'll glow this nice bright orange color, right before your plastic roadbed track melts into oblivion.

Transformers and batteries do NOT work together. At best, you'd have to build a circuit to convert the DC to AC, then go thru the transformer and re-convert from AC to DC. It's just not worth the troule.

Even using a potentiometer or a voltage regulator will not improve things in this case. There's just TOO MUCH CURRENT. If you applied the car battery to a standard 7809 voltage regulator, you're going to hear a crisp little "pop", see a tiny cloud of smoke.. and then you'd be buying a new one.

Use the 9v. Buy rechargables if you're worried about the planet or running for a long time inexpensively.

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13 years 7 months ago #10772 by Zcratchman_Joe
Replied by Zcratchman_Joe on topic Re: Transformer question
If you still want to use a car battery after reading all of this, you can do it for around $40.00-$50.00.

You mentioned running the train from a car battery, but you didn't mention if this battery would still be in the car. If the battery is not in a car, get yourself a regular old Marklin transformer off eBay. I recently saw an old blue one go for $20.00 including shipping. While you're on Ebay, shop around for a cheap "12V DC Car to 110V AC Power Inverter Converter" which one normally connects via hardwiring to the battery or into the cars electrical system. It should be around $25.00-$30.00. Hook up the Inverter to the battery and plug the transformer into the inverter. Of course, this means eventually you'll also need to charge the battery, so tack on another $30.00 for a battery charger.

If, on the other hand, you want to run the train while inside your car, you can buy an Inverter that plugs into your cigarette lighter and plug the transformer into that.

Does anyone see a problem doing it either of these ways?

Joe

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13 years 7 months ago #10773 by xj700
Replied by xj700 on topic Re: Transformer question
Well, I thought about the inverter idea, but in terms of discharge, I think that having the inverter, along with, the Marklin transformer (which I do have), discharge time on the car battery would be quicker than just having a 12 volt transformer only. I might go with the snail setup, depending if it will take the 12-14 volts off the battery. If worse come to worse though, I just will prolly stick to the original idea of using an inverter & Marklin setup. ;)

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13 years 7 months ago #10776 by SJ-BAZ-man
Replied by SJ-BAZ-man on topic Re: Transformer question
With the 12v 'Transormer', you mean to say conversion from 12v DC to 0-9V DC, like a variable power supply (like the Zthek Snail or Joerger controllers). You can also search the internet for "variable or Adjustable DC power supply" to find any 0-12 1/2 to 1Amp like these:

store.qkits.com/moreinfo.cfm/FK807
www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/powe/ck402.htm
www.hobbytron.com/Regulated-Power-Supply3.html
www.electrokits.com/electronics/power-supplies/86.htm

This will get you from 12v to 9 or 6:
store.qkits.com/moreinfo.cfm/FK805

As Zscratchman Joe suggests, in a car, you can use a cigarette adapter to connect to this variable supply or, a 'lantern' (torch) battery.

Jeff
SF Bay Area Z
DCC / Power moderator

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12 years 6 months ago - 12 years 6 months ago #13810 by xj700
Replied by xj700 on topic Re: Transformer question
I got it figured out.
I took an unused cell phone charger that plugs into the cigarette lighter & clipped off the plug.
I stripped the positive & negative wires on the charger.
I then bought from off of eBay the following LM2596 DC-DC Step Down CC-CV Adjustable Power Supply Module (usable from 1.5 volts all the way to 35 volts-if you want it-
You can get them here: www.aliexpress.com/product-fm/560349330-LM2596-DC-DC-Step-Down-CC-CV-Adjustable-Power-Supply-Module-Output-DC-1-5V-35V-wholesalers.html
The output voltage is adjusted by turning the small brass screw (you'll need an eyeglasses screwdriver to adjust).

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12 years 6 months ago #13811 by xj700
Replied by xj700 on topic Re: Transformer question
No eBay APP ID and/or Cert ID defined in Kunena configurationOh, one other thing...
I got it off eBay for $2.15, with free shipping!!!

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12 years 6 months ago #13812 by garthah
Replied by garthah on topic Re: Transformer question
Running off of a car battery is not a good idea it has such a high amperage rating a short can weld things, just consider what are arc you get if you flash the two clamp from a pair of jumper cables, this is really dangerous amount of current in this type of battery, even a motor cycle battery is problematic, and I would not even consider a 6 v lantern battery. Not just any potentiometer can handle that current you could end up with a fire in the pot.

Consider a Medvend hand controller or something similar using a 9v battery or small Rokuhan Controller using 8 x AAA batteries, you are less likely to burn or smoke an engine.

cheerz Garth

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12 years 6 months ago #13813 by xj700
Replied by xj700 on topic Re: Transformer question
Apparently you didn't read my last post-
My locomotives work fine with the LM2596 DC-DC Step Down CC-CV Adjustable Power Supply Module & cell phone charger while hooked into the cigarette lighter.

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